Fallout: MP vs SP

BackupLight · November 26, 2011, 09:00:37 PM

So far:

Backup:
I know there's a huge argument against Fallout having multiplayer, but I really wish it did. In the same fashion that RDR has it - large, open scale multiplayer free roam. The campaign, sure, makes more sense if you're solo - though games these days work in separate co-op campaigns really well so, who knows. Here's hoping for the next instalment, anyway!

Windy:
I'll tell ya right now there will no mp aspect in Fallout 4, there can't be. How do you pull it off? Maybe after Bethesda let Interplay run with Fallout Online, in the future they may bring their own mmorpg for Fallout and TES but the singleplayer is essential to the experience. Even mmorpgs aren't as personal and that's what brings the epicness, at least for me anyway. How do you deliver a story and experience where another player has an influence over events and make each player's experience ''full''. Very grey area that one. Mass Effect 3 takes the approach of co-op moving outside of each players 'Sheppard' and letting each one choose different races from the galaxies to adventure with and then there is a roll on affect back into the singleplayer experience. So that maybe a god way forward we'll see.

But alas singleplayer must always remain at the front of these kind of ''open world'' rpgs otherwise if not done right the experience is broken.
Multiplayer is great/fantastic but singleplayer will always be around.

Make sense? this should be another thread

BackupLight · November 26, 2011, 09:03:59 PM

I agree in that the single player experience works very well with the Fallout series, and is more than likely best left untouched to retain that immersion. On the other hand though, like in the case of Read Dead Redemption - the single player campaign would make no sense if you throw a co-op or multiplayer aspect into it, yet the restricted free roam that they made for online play actually brings a whole new feel to the same desert.

I can imagine something like that for Fallout, maybe limited to certain areas of the map and giving you objectives to clear out areas and set other objectives.

On the other hand, I see what you're saying - and the scale of the MP makes it practically something better suited to an online MMO of some sort rather than just a sub-section of the console game.

Edit:

I could also handle something akin to what ME3 is releasing, limited MP that has an effect on your campaign playthroughs.

Jaynestown · November 26, 2011, 09:13:44 PM

Hmmm, Fallout multiplayer, let me think about that one?

BackupLight · November 26, 2011, 11:52:47 PM

Quote from: Jaynestown on November 26, 2011, 09:13:44 PM
Hmmm, Fallout multiplayer, let me think about that one?

Take your time JT.

GamerMan316 · November 27, 2011, 11:21:15 AM

I've only played Fallout 3 for all of 4 hours so I guess my opinion won't matter as much as i've not had the total Fallout experience but i'd still say no to MP, leave them as immersive single player experiences, people seem to want MP on games just for the sake of it these days!

BackupLight · November 27, 2011, 11:47:28 AM

Quote from: GamerMan316 on November 27, 2011, 11:21:15 AM
I've only played Fallout 3 for all of 4 hours so I guess my opinion won't matter as much as i've not had the total Fallout experience but i'd still say no to MP, leave them as immersive single player experiences, people seem to want MP on games just for the sake of it these days!

Which is amusing to me given that all of a year or so ago I was strictly a SP kinda guy. Still, I'd only want MP in Fallout if it didn't in ANY way ruin the campaign experience. It's a good experience as is, forcing it to be something it isn't would be bad. The developers seem pretty anti-MP anyway so I'd doubt they'd bow to peer pressure in this.

sambo · November 27, 2011, 12:24:27 PM

I'm with GM on this, MP is chucked onto too many games these day's (Bioshock 2, Dead Space 2 just 2 examples). Games like Fallout and Mass Effect should be left as single player experiences. On the same hand, Battlefield and also to some extent CoD could lose the single player element and just concentrate on the multi-player.

Failed · November 27, 2011, 04:08:02 PM

MP is the best thing about RDR, it might even make Fallout bearable to play

Handshakes · November 27, 2011, 04:47:04 PM

There was a previous game in the Fallout series that did have multiplayer: Fallout Tactics.

Besides, lots of the classic RPGs of old included multiplayer: Baldur's Gate, Arcanum, etc... It can be done.

BackupLight · November 27, 2011, 06:44:07 PM

Quote from: sambo on November 27, 2011, 12:24:27 PM
I'm with GM on this, MP is chucked onto too many games these day's (Bioshock 2, Dead Space 2 just 2 examples). Games like Fallout and Mass Effect should be left as single player experiences. On the same hand, Battlefield and also to some extent CoD could lose the single player element and just concentrate on the multi-player.

Have you seen the multiplayer planned for Mass Effect 3, though? It actually looks pretty good, adds a certain new element to the game without killing off the single player nature of the series.

Lukehi · November 27, 2011, 06:47:48 PM

what about the MP style of Demon Souls? Innovative?

Windedprism · November 27, 2011, 08:03:24 PM

lol you made a separate thread and all!

Yeah Demon/Dark Souls used the multiplayer very differently. The thing with rpgs like Baldur's Gate/Diablo having multiplayer is that they ended up as ''shoot and loot''. I would love to have the full on story experience but bring another player into that. But the problem ends up with this: Borderlands, high level player comes into low level players game and whoops boss. It's the same with mmorpgs. FFXI online had an interesting element where the quest stories (although majorly crazy tbh) would play the cutscenes for each player individually, and then everyone could proceed with the mission etc together even if you were only there to help.

There were no dialogue choices however.Imagine you the player in conversation with an npc and your co-op buddy is there as well, having the ability to interject with their own lines of dialogue. The possibilities are certainly there. Choice of missions and quests to embark on would need to be agreed on by the human ''co-operation'' thus creating a whole new area of issues.

I think to create an rpg experience like this, a developer would almost need to dump the idea of SP and MP, and make a pure co-op experience.
It would take that much effort.

Fallout Online for example actually looks like Fallout 1/2 graphically and viewpoint wise, but Interplay don't have access to the gambryo engine used in Fallout 3/NV/Oblivion. But if you look at the design element of the Fallout series it has radically changed in it's approach, the older variant lends itself better to a MP exerience.

Monster Hunter, a series beloved in Japan has been warmly received in the west but never quite hit the same heights. So Capcom bring Dragon's Dogma to us with no MP, however gives the player 3/4 AI buddies to monster hunt with, another interesting twist.

Anyway, ultimately if it was done right as is the case with most MP it could be excellent. Sometimes though things never change,but it just takes one developer to take the chance and turn the lights on, Bioware ME3? maybe.

And I agree with Sambo about BF3 the singleplayer could easily not be there, look at Gears 3 though it has everything. Great Campaign, superb co-op (horde/beast/camp) and great MP action. A much more simple game than an open world rpg, but innovation can come from anywhere.

What was this thread about again?!??! way off point I think

Failed · November 28, 2011, 01:48:18 AM

Gears and Halo are the best examples of all-round games. A lot of SP games don't deserve MP's, but some you think would do better without actually work really well. Bioshock 2, The Darkness and Dead Space 2 are all MP's i've thought 'why?' and they've turned out really good.

Mass Effect 3 should be fun.

zerosum · November 28, 2011, 09:12:05 PM

Quote from: Failed on November 28, 2011, 01:48:18 AM
Gears and Halo are the best examples of all-round games. A lot of SP games don't deserve MP's, but some you think would do better without actually work really well. Bioshock 2, The Darkness and Dead Space 2 are all MP's i've thought 'why?' and they've turned out really good.

Mass Effect 3 should be fun.

And yet, Bioshock 2 has yet to win a [Friday Gamenight]. That makes for sad.

Windedprism · November 29, 2011, 11:51:27 AM

why not make a marathon christmas session and play a load of games in one night, Bioshock 2 anyone?
Gears 3
Red Dead
BF3/BC2
Reach/Anni
Bioshock
Gta IV

and so on and on, 24 hours drop in drop out egg nog, mulled wine, wine, beer, mince pies and anything else you can get your hands on and sleep deprivation!

Get to together with A-gamer maybe? different thread I think!